Legislature(2011 - 2012)BARNES 124

04/06/2011 01:00 PM House RESOURCES


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01:06:26 PM Start
01:07:20 PM Confirmation Hearing(s):
01:46:08 PM HB186
02:50:17 PM HJR20
03:40:33 PM Adjourn
* first hearing in first committee of referral
+ teleconferenced
= bill was previously heard/scheduled
+ Confirmation Hearings: TELECONFERENCED
Board of Fisheries
Board of Game
<Above Item to be Held Over from 4/4/11>
+= HB 186 WOOD BISON TELECONFERENCED
Heard & Held
-- Public Testimony --
+ HJR 20 ROADLESS RULE & CHUGACH AND TONGASS HYDRO TELECONFERENCED
Heard & Held
+= HB 195 PESTICIDES AND BROADCAST CHEMICALS TELECONFERENCED
<Bill Hearing Canceled>
+ Bills Previously Heard/Scheduled TELECONFERENCED
        HJR 20-ROADLESS RULE & CHUGACH AND TONGASS HYDRO                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
2:50:17 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
CO-CHAIR FEIGE  announced that the  next order of  business would                                                               
be HOUSE  JOINT RESOLUTION  NO. 20, Urging  the President  of the                                                               
United States, the  United States Congress, and  the Secretary of                                                               
the  United States  Department of  Agriculture  not to  implement                                                               
protection  of inventoried  roadless  areas  under the  "roadless                                                               
rule"  or   otherwise  restrict  the  development   of  necessary                                                               
hydroelectric  projects in  the Tongass  National Forest  and the                                                               
Chugach  National   Forest.    [Before  the   committee  was  HJR
20(ENE).]                                                                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
2:50:22 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  KYLE JOHANSEN,  Alaska State  Legislature, stated                                                               
that HJR 20 would urge the  U.S. President and the U.S. Secretary                                                               
of  Agriculture  not  to   implement  protection  of  inventoried                                                               
roadless areas.   He said he has had firsthand  experience with a                                                               
project to  fund two dams,  the Swan Lake and  Tyee Hydroelectric                                                               
Project.   The district  would like  to connect  the two  dams to                                                               
make an  electrical grid.  The  initial plan was to  build a road                                                               
alongside  for long-term  maintenance  and operation  to make  it                                                               
cheaper to construct  and maintain.  However, since  the road was                                                               
negotiated outside  the plan, materials  had to be brought  in by                                                               
helicopter.   Additionally, all  maintenance and  operations must                                                               
be performed by helicopter.   He pointed out that the communities                                                               
are even  having difficulty  obtaining permission  for helicopter                                                               
landings.  Thus, his district  has had first-hand experience with                                                               
the  difficulties  of  building  a project  without  a  road  and                                                               
suffering  the additional  project costs.   He  expressed concern                                                               
about the issuance of "roadless rule."                                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
2:52:35 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  JOHANSEN  reported  testimony  given  before  the                                                               
House Energy Committee  with respect to the Blue  Lake project in                                                               
Sitka.   The community would like  to increase the height  of its                                                               
dam and the  "roadless rule" puts into question  whether that can                                                               
be accomplished.  He noted  a logical progression of events needs                                                               
to happen.   This  rule could be  used to slow  down or  stop the                                                               
project.   He  pointed out  one challenge  is that  the "roadless                                                               
rule" designates just  one person - a federal  employee back East                                                               
- to  rule whether a  road can be built.   He predicted  a "scary                                                               
future" unless  the "roadless rule  is addressed.  He  noted that                                                               
Alaska's  Congressional  delegation  comprised of  U.S.  Senators                                                               
Begich   and  L.   Murkowski   and   Congressman  Young   support                                                               
challenging the "roadless rule."   In response to Co-Chair Feige,                                                               
he explained  the difference between the  original resolution and                                                               
the  committee  substitute (CS).    He  remarked that  the  House                                                               
Energy Committee  overlooked the  fact that U.S.  President Obama                                                               
has set  a goal of having  25 percent of the  energy generated in                                                               
the U.S.  come from  renewable "green" resources  by 2025.   That                                                               
language was added to the resolution, he said.                                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
2:55:08 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
FLOYD KOOKESH  noted that he is  a former mayor of  Angoon and is                                                               
testifying on  behalf of the  current mayor of Angoon,  Albert H.                                                               
Howard.   He  read  the following  written  statement from  Mayor                                                               
Howard, as follows [original punctuation provided]:                                                                             
                                                                                                                                
     First of all thank you  for the opportunity to speak on                                                                    
     such an  important matter, that  impacts the  future of                                                                    
     the community of  Angoon as well as  our community's of                                                                    
     southeast and the  State of Alaska for that  matter.  I                                                                    
     would like  to thank my Representative  Bill Thomas and                                                                    
     all  the other  representatives that  have co-sponsored                                                                    
     this important House Joint Resolution.                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
     I  am a  firm believer  in the  public process,  having                                                                    
     said that  to me the road  less rule is a  good example                                                                    
     of leaving the public out of the process.                                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
     Alaska is a young  infrastructure state compared to the                                                                    
     rest of our country.   The Roadless Rule has a negative                                                                    
     impact in  so many ways  as far as getting  much needed                                                                    
     projects  built that  serve for  the betterment  of our                                                                    
     communities and citizens of our state.                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
     I am sure in some ways  the Roadless Rule serves a good                                                                    
     purpose for some,  but as a blanket rule  it hurts more                                                                    
     then it helps.                                                                                                             
                                                                                                                                
     I am testifying in favor  of and asking this government                                                                    
     body to support and pass  House Joint Resolution No. 20                                                                    
     as it  will send  a unified message  that this  type of                                                                    
     Rule does  not work for  all and  that we, as  a state,                                                                    
     can implement  our own rules  as needed,  thus allowing                                                                    
     our state the right to self-determination.                                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
2:58:21 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
JIM STRANDBERG, Project Manager,  Alaska Industrial Development &                                                               
export  Authority  (AIDEA)  and Alaska  Energy  Authority  (AEA),                                                               
stated  he  is  currently  a  project  manager  for  the  AEA  on                                                               
Southeast Alaska projects.   Thus, his comments on  behalf of the                                                               
AEA  are  being  presented  from the  perspective  of  the  AEA's                                                               
position  as  a  funder  and  developer  of  hydroelectric  power                                                               
projects  in the  Tongass  National  Forest roadless  inventoried                                                               
areas.    He offered  his  view  that the  HJR  20  focused on  a                                                               
difficult  and   time  consuming  decision-making   process  that                                                               
elevates local  and regional decisions  to the U.S.  Secretary of                                                               
Agriculture level.   The AEA has concerns with  this approach and                                                               
the effect  on its  ability to  economically pursue  projects, he                                                               
said.                                                                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
2:59:29 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
MR. STRANDBERG reported on energy  projects, such that AEA, as an                                                               
independent  state  agency  receives capital  appropriations  for                                                               
construction the  construction of hydro and  transmission lines -                                                               
a number of  which are in the inventoried roadless  rule areas of                                                               
the Tongass  National Forest.   He pointed  out that the  AEA was                                                               
the granting agency  for the $46 million completion  of the Swan-                                                               
Tyee Intertie that Representative Johansen  spoke of earlier.  He                                                               
indicated that the  AEA worked closely with  the Southeast Alaska                                                               
Power  Agency   (SEAPA)  in  accomplishing   the  project.     He                                                               
emphasized that  the project was  a significantly  more expensive                                                               
process  because   of  the   "roadless  rule"   requirements  and                                                               
conditions  placed on  the  project.   He  reported  the AEA  has                                                               
expertise in  alternative and  renewable energy  technologies and                                                               
manages the Renewable Grant Program.   A number of hydro projects                                                               
in the  roadless areas  are partially funded  by the  AEA's grant                                                               
program, he said.                                                                                                               
                                                                                                                                
3:00:37 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
MR. STRANDBERG related the recent  "roadless rule" decision could                                                               
have an  impact on the AEA's  effectiveness on our projects.   He                                                               
characterized  the situation  as  being  an emergency  situation.                                                               
The AEA has  concerns about the approval processes  which must be                                                               
employed  under the  current rules  to allow  the AEA  to proceed                                                               
timely and complete the projects.                                                                                               
                                                                                                                                
MR.  STRANDBERG noted  that while  some mention  was made  in the                                                               
recent  court  decision  of  the   ability  to  construct  energy                                                               
infrastructure  within   roadless  inventoried   areas,  economic                                                               
access  has  not yet  been  defined.    He  inquired as  to  what                                                               
constitutes  economic access.   He  used the  Petersburg to  Kake                                                               
Intertie  project,  which  is currently  in  the  permitting  and                                                               
design phases as  an example.  The economic life  of this project                                                               
depends on the  ability of the project team to  use logging roads                                                               
for construction  access and long-term  maintenance of  the line.                                                               
These  economic   access  conditions  must  also   be  known  and                                                               
measureable  during   the  time  of  permitting,   since  funding                                                               
decisions  are based  on the  viability of  the projects  and the                                                               
ultimate construction  costs of  the projects.   He  stressed the                                                               
importance of clarity  of rules and access priority  in order for                                                               
the  AEA to  pursue  projects  for its  Southeast  partners.   He                                                               
expressed concern  with the hydro  power generation  projects, as                                                               
well.   He  explained  that  in order  to  build these  important                                                               
projects the  AEA must have on  the ground access to  place heavy                                                               
construction  components,  turbines,   penstocks,  and  diversion                                                               
dams.                                                                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
MR.   STRANDBERG   reiterated    that   clarity   for   practical                                                               
construction  and  long-term  maintenance  are  a  must  for  the                                                               
economic life  of the projects.   Clear and reasonable  rules and                                                               
time-defined  decision-making processes  will lower  the cost  of                                                               
power  for Southeast  Alaskans are  fundamental  to the  economic                                                               
recovery of the region, he  said.  He predicted that unreasonable                                                               
rules will cost money and  will directly affect the all Southeast                                                               
Alaskans.                                                                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
3:03:43 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
JOHN SANDOR, Board Member,  Alaska-Canada Energy Coalition, noted                                                               
he first  came to  Alaska in  1953 to  conduct forest  surveys in                                                               
Southeast  Alaska.   He related  he is  a certified  forester and                                                               
served as the U.S. Forest  Service's Regional Forester from 1976-                                                               
1984,  and  as  the  commissioner of  the  Alaska  Department  of                                                               
Environmental  Conservation  from 1990-1994.    He  stated he  is                                                               
speaking on  behalf of  the Alaska-Canada  Energy Coalition.   He                                                               
read from  the following written statement  [original punctuation                                                               
provided]:                                                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
     I  am  a  Board  Member  of  the  Alaska-Canada  Energy                                                                    
     Coalition and  want to report  for your  Hearing Record                                                                    
     that Coalition President  Ernie Christian and Executive                                                                    
     Director  Paul  Southland  have  approved  a  Coalition                                                                    
     Resolution Opposing Reinstatement  of the Roadless Rule                                                                    
     on the Tongass National Forest.                                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
     In   summary,   the  Alaska-Canada   Energy   Coalition                                                                    
     Resolution  determined  that  the  Roadless  Rule  will                                                                    
     limit or preclude resource  development projects on the                                                                    
     Tongass  National   forest  Roadless   areas  including                                                                    
     development  of eighteen  of twenty  seven U.S.  Forest                                                                    
     Service   Energy  Program   projects  currently   under                                                                    
     application and review on  the Tongass National Forest.                                                                    
     A  listing  of  these  projects  is  attached  to  this                                                                    
     testimony.                                                                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
     The Alaska Canada  Energy Coalition Resolution supports                                                                    
     Alaska's  appeal of  the March  4, 2011  District Court                                                                    
     ruling  reinstating the  2001 Clinton  Administration's                                                                    
     Roadless  Rule on  the Tongass  National  Forest.   The                                                                    
     Coalition Resolution also  supports efforts urging USDA                                                                    
     Secretary  Vilsack  finalize   the  2003  interim  rule                                                                    
     exempting  the Tongass  National Forest  from the  2001                                                                    
     Roadless Rule.                                                                                                             
                                                                                                                                
     Thank  you  again,  for  the  opportunity  to  testify.                                                                    
     Alaska  House of  Representatives Joint  Resolution No.                                                                    
     20 will help  assure Alaska's National Forest-dependent                                                                    
     communities   have  access   to   the  development   of                                                                    
     resources  that  can  strengthen  their  economics  and                                                                    
     quality of life values.                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
3:06:38 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
FRED  MORINO referred  to a  handout in  members' packets  titled                                                               
Alaska's Scenic  Byways that highlights the  scenic byways, which                                                               
represent  1,200 miles  of roadways.    He said  he supports  the                                                               
resolution, HJR  20, for many  of the  same reasons given  by Mr.                                                               
Sandor,  such  as hydro,  but  also  for  tourism and  access  to                                                               
resources.   He said he is  a lifelong Alaskan and  believes that                                                               
Alaska  should develop  its resources  to have  control over  its                                                               
destiny  and  to  take over  responsibilities  from  the  federal                                                               
government.                                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
3:07:47 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
DUFF MITCHELL, Business Manager,  Juneau Hydropower, Inc. related                                                               
that he grew  up in Alaska and  has lived most of  his life here.                                                               
He  stated  that he  currently  serves  as the  business  manager                                                               
Juneau Hydropower,  Inc.   He read from  a prepared  statement as                                                               
follows [original punctuation provided]:                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
     I  am  Duff  Mitchell,   Business  Manager  for  Juneau                                                                    
     Hydropower Inc.  Our company  has the  FERC preliminary                                                                    
     permit  for the  Sweetheart Lake  Hydroelectric Project                                                                    
     which is  located about 35  miles south of  Juneau. The                                                                    
     project  is a  30 Megawatt  (MW) capacity  project that                                                                    
     could contribute up to 136,000  Megawatt Hours (MWh) of                                                                    
     electricity for  Southeast Alaska. We are  currently on                                                                    
     track to develop this project.                                                                                             
                                                                                                                                
     I would like to thank  you for the opportunity to speak                                                                    
     on   favor  of   passing  this   resolution.  I   would                                                                    
     personally  like  to  thank   Rep.  Kyle  Johansen  for                                                                    
     sponsoring this resolution. I would  also like to thank                                                                    
     Rep.  Bill  Thomas,  Rep. Peggy  Wilson  and  Rep  Bill                                                                    
     Stoltze  for co-sponsoring  this important  House Joint                                                                    
     Resolution  that sends  a message  to federal  decision                                                                    
     makers  that   Alaska  is  serious   about  responsibly                                                                    
     developing   our   resources  in   an   environmentally                                                                    
     sensitive manner.                                                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
     My  testimony is  to favor  expeditious passage  on HJR
     20.  It  has  become   apparent  that  if  the  Tongass                                                                    
     National Forest  is not exempt from  the administrative                                                                    
     Roadless Rule,  and its subsequent  implementation that                                                                    
     this rule  could have a  chilling effect  on hydropower                                                                    
     development   and   transmission  line   infrastructure                                                                    
     within  Southeast Alaska  that encompasses  the Tongass                                                                    
     National Forest. If not timely  resolved, the impact of                                                                    
     the  Roadless   Rule  implementation   will  decelerate                                                                    
     current  Alaska  hydropower  investment,  hold  up  our                                                                    
     region's  economic  development,  hasten  our  regional                                                                    
     population decline, and  block regional energy security                                                                    
     by  depriving   Alaska  citizens  and   developers  the                                                                    
     opportunity and  their federal right under  the Federal                                                                    
     Power  Act to  develop renewable  hydropower energy  in                                                                    
     the Tongass and Chugach National Forests.                                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
     Ironically,  it  is  our federal  government  that  has                                                                    
     investigated over 200 hydropower  sites in Alaska. From                                                                    
     1900 to 1950 our  federal government has spent millions                                                                    
     in  today's dollars  for hydropower  investigations and                                                                    
     development in  what was then the  Alaska Territory for                                                                    
     stream  gaging, engineering  and conducting  geological                                                                    
     reconnaissance on potential Alaska hydropower sites.                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
     Further because  we were a territory  with vast amounts                                                                    
     of  public land,  Alaska has  dozens of  federal Public                                                                    
     Land  Orders,  Power   Site  Classification  sites  and                                                                    
     federal power  withdrawals in the existing  Tongass and                                                                    
     Chugach  National Forest  signed  by  the Secretary  of                                                                    
     Interior  with authority  delegated from  the President                                                                    
     of the United States  expressly reserving these Tongass                                                                    
     and  Chugach  lands  specifically  for  the  hydropower                                                                    
     energy benefit  of the citizens  of the  United States.                                                                    
     Some  of these  orders are  over 90  years old  and are                                                                    
     valid  Public  Land  Orders   today  that  predate  the                                                                    
     Tongass Land Management Plan and the Roadless Rule.                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
     Further, the  State of  Alaska already  has established                                                                    
     and recorded  rights of way for  roads and transmission                                                                    
     line  corridors within  the Tongass  for the  Southeast                                                                    
     Intertie  transmission  system.   We  ask  that  Alaska                                                                    
     should assert itself that the  Roadless Rule should not                                                                    
     pre-empt   these   and    other   existing   road   and                                                                    
     transmission  and utility  corridor rights  provided to                                                                    
     the State of Alaska.                                                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
3:11:40 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
MR. MITCHELL continued:                                                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
     I would also  like to point out that  the US Department                                                                    
     of  Energy,   US  Department   of  Interior,   and  the                                                                    
     Department  of  the  Army all  signed  a  2010  Federal                                                                    
     Memorandum  of   Understanding  on  the   promotion  of                                                                    
     hydropower  development  to  "help  meet  the  Nation's                                                                    
     needs  for  reliable, affordable,  and  environmentally                                                                    
     sustainable hydropower…"  The Secretary  of Agriculture                                                                    
     was  not a  signatory of  this document.  Now that  the                                                                    
     Roadless Rule exemption for  Alaska has been overturned                                                                    
     by Judge  Sedwick, I  would suggest  that it  is timely                                                                    
     that  the President  and Congress  hasten  to have  the                                                                    
     Secretary  of Agriculture  become  a  signatory on  the                                                                    
     2010  Federal  Hydropower Memorandum  of  Understanding                                                                    
     and  execute  a  new  Alaska  Roadless  Rule  exempting                                                                    
     Alaska    hydropower    and    associated    hydropower                                                                    
     transmission lines.                                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
     HJR  20  provides  a  means   for  Alaskans  under  the                                                                    
     leadership   of  this   body  to   send  a   clear  and                                                                    
     unequivocal message to our  President and Congress that                                                                    
     our  federal   government  should  be   consistent  and                                                                    
     unified in renewable  hydropower energy development and                                                                    
     demonstrate  sensitivity  to   Alaskan  needs  in  this                                                                    
     matter.  Exempting  Alaska  from  the  administratively                                                                    
     created  Roadless  Rule  will allow  Alaskan  citizens,                                                                    
     developers and utilities the  opportunity to assist our                                                                    
     Nation in lessening our  Nation's dependence on foreign                                                                    
     fuel  sources, improve  our  Nation's energy  security,                                                                    
     and  lessen  our   Nation's  trade  deficit  imbalance.                                                                    
     Exempting Alaska  from the  Roadless Rule  provides the                                                                    
     opportunity  for  Alaskans   to  develop  our  Nation's                                                                    
     hydropower  resources   in  the  Tongass   and  Chugach                                                                    
     National  Forests in  an  environmentally sound  manner                                                                    
     for  the  betterment of  our  Nation  which these  pre-                                                                    
     existing public land orders  and power withdrawal sites                                                                    
     were originally intended.                                                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
     I urge the Resources  Committee to pass this resolution                                                                    
     and   request    that   House   and    Senate   members                                                                    
     expeditiously  pass   HJR  20.   Again,  I   thank  the                                                                    
     Resources Committee Chairmen and  members for the honor                                                                    
     and privilege in allowing me to speak on this matter.                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
3:14:00 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
SHELLY WRIGHT, Executive Director, Southeast Conference, on                                                                     
behalf of the Southeast Conference reading from a proclamation                                                                  
by President  Roosevelt, read,  as follows  [original punctuation                                                               
provided]:                                                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
     And now,  first and foremost,  you can never  afford to                                                                    
     forget for  a moment what  is the object of  our forest                                                                    
     policy. That object is not  to preserve forests because                                                                    
     they  beautiful, though  that  is good  in itself;  nor                                                                    
     because they are refuges for  the wild creatures of the                                                                    
     wilderness, though  that, too,  is good in  itself; but                                                                    
     the  primary object  of our  forest policy,  as of  the                                                                    
     land  policy of  the Unites  States, is  the making  of                                                                    
     prosperous homes. It is part  of the traditional policy                                                                    
     of   home   making   in  our   country.   Every   other                                                                    
     consideration comes  as secondary. You  yourselves have                                                                    
     got to  keep this  practical object before  your minds:                                                                    
     to remember that a forest  which contributes nothing to                                                                    
     the wealth,  progress, or safety  of the country  is of                                                                    
     no interest to the Government,  and should be of little                                                                    
     interest  to  the  forester.  Your  attention  must  be                                                                    
     directed to the preservation of  forests, not as an end                                                                    
     in  itself,   but  as  the  means   of  preserving  and                                                                    
     increasing the prosperity of the nation.                                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
3:15:27 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
MS. WRIGHT explained the value of  HJR 20 as two-fold.  First and                                                               
foremost,  the  people  who  have  been  living  in  the  Tongass                                                               
National  Forest have  been fighting  this resolution  for years,                                                               
she  said.    She  characterized the  people  as  scratching  and                                                               
clawing  over the  "roadless rule"  for years.   She  related the                                                               
beauty of HJR  20 is that the state would  be standing behind the                                                               
people saying it has had enough.   She urged members to pass this                                                               
resolution and  stand behind  the people  of Southeast  Alaska to                                                               
tell the  government that Alaska  needs to  have some use  of its                                                               
lands, assert  the necessity of  the hydro projects, and  be able                                                               
to live on its land and survive.                                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
3:16:41 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
PETER NAOROZ,  General Manager and President,  Kootznoowoo, Inc.,                                                               
on behalf of  Kootznoowoo, Inc. stated that his  corporation is a                                                               
village corporation  for the community  of Angoon located  in the                                                               
center of  Admiralty Island.   The corporation consists  of 1,065                                                               
shareholders, with  about 25 percent  residing in Angoon  and the                                                               
remaining   shareholders   residing    in   Juneau   and   Sitka.                                                               
Additionally,  the corporation  has interests  in this  "roadless                                                               
rule"   because  Admiralty   Island   is   a  national   monument                                                               
wilderness.  As  part of the Alaska Native  Settlement Claims Act                                                               
(ANSCA)  settlement, the  corporation negotiated  the ability  to                                                               
build  a hydroelectric  project  on the  island.   The  "roadless                                                               
rule"  does not  specifically impact  Kootznoowoo, Inc.  since it                                                               
lies in  a wilderness.   He  explained the  corporation requested                                                               
this  specific provision  from the  Congress because  it did  not                                                               
trust  the powers  to be  in the  future.   However, Kootznoowoo,                                                               
Inc.  selected lands  on Prince  of Wales  Island close  to where                                                               
Representative Johansen lives.   The corporation would desires to                                                               
have roads in  its 23,000 acres connected to the  system but it's                                                               
not  likely  due  to  this  "roadless  rule."    He  pointed  out                                                               
resources that belong to Alaska  that are inaccessible, that some                                                               
communities want to be part  of economic development, or have the                                                               
opportunity to  drive to work.   He  exclaimed that Alaska  is in                                                               
the  21st  century.    In  1952,  the  blue  book  described  the                                                               
potential of energy in Alaska as  $200 million.  He was unsure of                                                               
the value  in today's  dollars.   He offered  support for  HJR 20                                                               
because "it  shines a light"  on a very  dark spot and  a problem                                                               
that this state has."                                                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
3:19:30 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
MR. NAOROZ stated  that even before the  exemption was overturned                                                               
by federal  Judge Sedwick, the  corporation had a  difficult time                                                               
getting permission to  do things on the  Tongass National Forest.                                                               
He stated that  his company provided 25 pages of  comments on the                                                               
Tongass Land  Use Management Plan  (TLUMP).  He related  that the                                                               
Kootznoowoo,  Inc. asked  for two  corridor sections,  which were                                                               
completely ignored.  The Kootznoowoo,  Inc. has an appeal sitting                                                               
here.   One  corridor  would  provide a  reliable  back door  for                                                               
Juneau's  power and  the other  one would  take power  across its                                                               
Prince of  Wales land to  the Niblack  Mine.  He  further related                                                               
that  while  the  corridors  were  to  be  discussed  later,  the                                                               
exemption is gone  and we have "death by a  thousand paper cuts."                                                               
He hoped  the light is bright  enough with passage of  HJR 20 for                                                               
President Obama to wake up and  realize that this is the means to                                                               
achieve renewable  energy goals.  He  offered Kootznoowoo, Inc.'s                                                               
support to the committee, with respect to HJR 20.                                                                               
                                                                                                                                
3:21:16 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
MIKE  SATRE,  Executive  Director, Council  of  Alaska  Producers                                                               
(CAP),  on  behalf  of  the  CAP, related  that  the  removal  of                                                               
exemption  from the  Tongass National  Forest from  the "roadless                                                               
rule" is a  "slap in the face, a  kick in the gut, and  a spit in                                                               
the eye" to any resident of  Southeast Alaska who wants to ensure                                                               
that we have  an economically viable population  into the future.                                                               
This resolution  particularly addresses the electric  projects in                                                               
the region  which are critically  important for  potential mining                                                               
projects but for the sustainability  of existing mining projects.                                                               
He emphasized the importance of HJR  20 in terms of diesel prices                                                               
and  the need  to  develop hydro  sources  to ensure  sustainable                                                               
energy.  He urged members  to pass this resolution from committee                                                               
with their full support.                                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
3:22:55 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
ERIC LEE  stated he is  a commercial  fisherman who has  lived in                                                               
Petersburg his entire  life.  He said that  Petersburg is located                                                               
on Mitkof  Island, a small  island in  the middle of  the Tongass                                                               
National Forest.   He has seen  the damage done by  the extensive                                                               
roads for logging  on Mitkof Island.  He has  observed the damage                                                               
to habitat and fish streams caused  by logging roads.  He related                                                               
that Mitkof  Island is 24  miles long but  has over 150  miles of                                                               
road.   Many other islands  have also seen numerous  roads built.                                                               
He offered his  belief that the roads have resulted  in a serious                                                               
decline in deer populations and  damage to salmon stream spawning                                                               
habitat  due to  silt and  blockage due  to improperly  installed                                                               
culverts.   He said he  believed the  problems will only  be made                                                               
worse if  additional roads are  allowed and that  residents would                                                               
be  far better  off by  properly maintaining  the currently  road                                                               
system,  protecting  the  last  roadless  areas  in  the  Tongass                                                               
National Forest  for future  generations.   He remarked  that any                                                               
perceived  concerns  regarding hydro  projects  can  and will  be                                                               
dealt with  through specific adjustments to  the "roadless rule."                                                               
He concluded that the concerns  addressed today will prove not to                                                               
be valid.   He offered his  support for the "roadless  rule."  He                                                               
said he thought it would protect  what is left of the Tongass for                                                               
the future.                                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
3:25:24 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
MARILYN  LELAND,  Executive  Director, Alaska  Power  Association                                                               
(APA), on behalf of the APA,  related that the APA is a statewide                                                               
association  that provides  power  to more  than  a half  million                                                               
Alaskans  from   Barrow  to  Southwestern  Alaska,   through  the                                                               
Interior, and Southcentral Alaska to  Southeast Alaska.  She said                                                               
that  the  APA strongly  supports  HJR  20 opposing  the  federal                                                               
administration's  unreasonable   efforts  with  respect   to  the                                                               
implementation  of  the  "roadless   rule"  regulations  for  the                                                               
Tongass and Chugach National Forests.                                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
MS. LELAND  stated that  Alaska is blessed  with an  abundance of                                                               
hydro  resources from  its lakes  and streams  that can  be built                                                               
with  minimal  impact.   Most  new  hydro development  in  Alaska                                                               
replaces  costly, finite,  and less  environmental benign  fossil                                                               
generation  fuels,  typically  diesel,  coal,  and  natural  gas.                                                               
Hydro  development has  been encouraged  and  projects are  being                                                               
pursued from  Southeast Alaska, the Railbelt,  Western Alaska and                                                               
the Aleutians.  Special use  permits necessary in "roadless rule"                                                               
areas of national forests must  now be individually signed by the                                                               
U.S. Secretary  of the Department of  Agriculture.  Additionally,                                                               
to the  "roadless rule"  permits, forest land  use plans  must be                                                               
amended to accommodate hydro projects  located in designated back                                                               
country areas  of our  national forests.   These  federal actions                                                               
could add a year or longer  to the hydro project approval process                                                               
seriously  jeopardizing  the  three  year  time  frame  in  which                                                               
applicants are  bound to  perfect their  permits.   The "roadless                                                               
rule"  creates an  unnecessary impediment  to  the FERC  process.                                                               
She predicted  that it is  possible some hydro projects  could be                                                               
killed by this  rule.  She urged  members to move HJR  20 and for                                                               
the legislature approve this resolution.                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
3:27:54 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
JOSEPH SEBASTIAN stated that he  is a 33-year Alaska resident and                                                               
has worked as a commercial fisherman  and a homesteader.  He said                                                               
the Prince of  Wales Island's history was  highlighted in earlier                                                               
testimony.  In 1952, the Prince  of Wales Island had less than 50                                                               
miles of road  on the entire island.  However,  by 1997, when the                                                               
pulp  mill contract  expired  the island  had  expanded its  road                                                               
system to  4,500 miles of  road.   He stated this  trend happened                                                               
across  the entire  U.S.   He  characterized it  as public  lands                                                               
facing maximum  exploitation and without any  action public lands                                                               
would disappear.   He heard  previous speakers stating  they were                                                               
not done "exploiting" the Tongass  yet, but that type of thinking                                                               
never  ends.    He  related  that  the  current  "roadless  rule"                                                               
decision  is  in   a  state  of  flux  between   the  court,  the                                                               
plaintiffs,  and  the  U.S.  Forest  Service.    He  related  his                                                               
understanding  that the  parties  involved have  been working  to                                                               
remove  any  impediments  to hydro  projects  since  all  parties                                                               
recognize  the  importance  of  hydro  to  Southeast  Alaska,  in                                                               
particular,  not salmon-impacting  hydro projects.   He  remarked                                                               
that the  parties overwhelmingly  support the hydro  projects. He                                                               
thought this current  ruling is a glitch and  he anticipated that                                                               
all parties would work out  an agreeable solution within the next                                                               
month or two.                                                                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
3:30:17 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
MR.  SEBASTIAN  offered  his  belief  that  the  "roadless  rule"                                                               
protects  the Alaskan  way of  life  and the  reason many  people                                                               
initially came  to Alaska.   Roads cause  the greatest  damage in                                                               
the Tongass  National Forest  through erosion.   He  reported the                                                               
U.S. Forest  Service's data estimates  2,400 blocked  culverts in                                                               
the Tongass  National Forest  alone.   These blocked  culverts no                                                               
longer allow fish  or smolts to pass and  are considered damaging                                                               
to  salmon fish  or production.   He  related that  the "roadless                                                               
rule"  protects  the headwaters  of  streams.   He  characterized                                                               
these streams  as class II and  class III streams that  flow into                                                               
class  I  streams.    Many  of  the  larger  blocks  of  roadless                                                               
landscape in  the forest, such  as the Cleveland  Peninsula, Port                                                               
Houghton  on the  mainland  north of  Petersburg,  and East  Kuiu                                                               
areas  are on  ADF&G's 19  top-producing watersheds  in Southeast                                                               
Alaska.   He characterized  these areas  as "treasure  troves" of                                                               
salmon, bear, deer,  bear, moose, and mountain goats.   He stated                                                               
that these  areas represent valuable  habitat and resources.   He                                                               
said, "These aren't  just places that, you  know, are willy-nilly                                                               
being removed from  the public trust.  They remain  in the public                                                               
trust for  the use of  the public.   They're just removed  from a                                                               
level of  "exploitation"."   He remarked that  it's done  so much                                                               
damage in the Tongass National Forest.                                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
3:32:17 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
MR. SEBASTIAN said  he views the "roadless rule" in  the same way                                                               
he that  he views the Alaska  Permanent Fund, which is  that this                                                               
area has been land set aside for  the future.  He pointed out the                                                               
currently  climate   changes  in  northern  and   western  Alaska                                                               
demonstrate  the   natural  circumstances  beyond   our  control.                                                               
Alaska has been losing its  icepack, which has caused villages to                                                               
be washed  away.   These roadless areas  and the  protection they                                                               
enjoy could  be preserved for the  future.  He surmised  that the                                                               
state  may be  able to  charge money  for the  lands as  a carbon                                                               
bank.   He stated that  these lands represent a  national reserve                                                               
for our  children and future residents  of this state.   He urged                                                               
members  to take  a  long-term view  to  consider the  resources,                                                               
including the  fragile nature and  exploitation of  the resources                                                               
changes the very nature of them.   He offered his support for the                                                               
"roadless rule" and urged the committee to do the same.                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
3:33:58 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
TIM  ROONEY, Borough  Manager,  City &  Borough  of Wrangell,  on                                                               
behalf of the City & Borough  of Wrangell (CBW), spoke in support                                                               
of HJR 20.   He said he  also serves as second  vice president of                                                               
Southeast Conference and the Wrangell  alternate on the Southeast                                                               
Alaska  Power  Association  (SEAPA)   board.    He  related  that                                                               
protection  of  the  inventoried   roadless  areas  will  have  a                                                               
detrimental impact  on the ability to  expand hydroelectric power                                                               
generation and transmission in Southeast  Alaska.  He stated that                                                               
Wrangell has affordable  electric rates, but it is one  of only a                                                               
handful of  communities with affordable  energy rates  in Alaska.                                                               
He offered his belief that  if federal approval of hydro projects                                                               
doesn't  happen   that  other  communities  will   never  get  to                                                               
experience the  affordable rates that  his community offers.   He                                                               
offered his  view that  the continued burning  of diesel  fuel is                                                               
more  harmful to  the  environment than  the  development of  any                                                               
hydro project.  He referred  to the governor's goal of generating                                                               
50  percent of  energy  in the  state  from renewable  resources,                                                               
which   is    in   addition    to   President    Barack   Obama's                                                               
administration's goals.  He was unsure  of how the goals would be                                                               
met  if the  "roadless rule"  were applied  in this  region.   He                                                               
reported that the  CBW adopted a nearly identical  version of the                                                               
resolution  before  committee  members   today.    He  encouraged                                                               
members and the legislature to do the same.                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
3:35:46 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
DAVE  CARLSON,   Chief  Executive  Officer,  on   behalf  of  the                                                               
Southeast  Alaska  Power  Association (SEAPA),  stated  that  the                                                               
SEAPA  owns  two hydro  projects  in  southern Southeast  Alaska,                                                               
along with approximately 170 miles  of transmission lines between                                                               
Ketchikan,  Wrangell  and  Petersburg.   He  related  that  SEAPA                                                               
provides 100  percent of  Wrangell's electrical  generation needs                                                               
and half of  Ketchikan's needs with hydro power.   He stated that                                                               
SEAPA strongly supports  HJR 20.  He offered his  belief that the                                                               
"roadless  rule"  rule  is  a  killer  to  the  economy,  to  new                                                               
transmission  lines, and  to new  hydro projects.   He  explained                                                               
that  35 percent  of the  Tongass  National Forest  has been  set                                                               
aside as  monuments and wilderness and  is off limits.   The area                                                               
affected  by the  "roadless rule"  encompasses  about 57  percent                                                               
that would be  off limits.  Added together,  this would represent                                                               
92 percent  of the national  forest, he  said.  He  reiterated it                                                               
would be  very difficult  to build new  hydro projects  under the                                                               
"roadless rule."   He pointed out  that he works "on  the ground"                                                               
to maintain  transmission lines using  helicopters.   He affirmed                                                               
earlier  testimony, that  helicopters  cost approximately  $1,000                                                               
per hour.   He  remarked that  the total  ratepayer costs  per KW                                                               
hour  increase when  utilities must  use helicopters  rather than                                                               
roads  to  build  and  maintain   transmission  lines  and  hydro                                                               
projects.  He reiterated SEAPA's strong support for HJR 20.                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
3:37:26 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
STEVE  BORELL,  Executive  Director,  Alaska  Miners  Association                                                               
(AMA), offered the AMA's support of  HJR 20.  He paraphrased from                                                               
his   written  testimony,   as   follows  [original   punctuation                                                               
provided]:                                                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
     My name  is Steve  Borell, I  am Executive  Director of                                                                    
     the  Alaska Miners  Association  and  am testifying  on                                                                    
     behalf of the Association.                                                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
     We   support  House   Joint   Resolution  20   opposing                                                                    
     implementation of the roadless rule.                                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
     The roadless  rule has  been a  moving target  since it                                                                    
     was  first  introduced.    The  Clinton  Administration                                                                    
     changed its mind two  times during rulemaking regarding                                                                    
     whether  or not  the  nationwide Roadless  Rule  should                                                                    
     apply to  the Tongass  National Forest before  making a                                                                    
     third  change  by extending  the  Rule  to the  Tongass                                                                    
     National Forest on January 12, 2001.                                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
     In  2001  the  State  of  Alaska  litigated  the  Final                                                                    
     Roadless  Rule on  the ground,  among  others, that  it                                                                    
     violated  §  1326 (a),  the  "no  more" clause  of  the                                                                    
     Alaska   National  Interest   Lands  Conservation   Act                                                                    
     (ANILCA).   In 2003 the Federal  Government settled the                                                                    
     State's lawsuit  by promulgating  an interim  rule that                                                                    
     exempted the Tongass National  Forest from the Roadless                                                                    
     Rule  and  Alaska  remained  exempt  under  the  "State                                                                    
     Petition  Rule"  promulgated  in  2005.    The  Tongass                                                                    
     remained exempt  under the interim rule  even after the                                                                    
     Ninth Circuit  Court of Appeals  struck down  the State                                                                    
     Petition Rule in 2009.                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
     However, on  March 4, 2011  the District Court  for the                                                                    
     District  of Alaska  determined that  the interim  rule                                                                    
     exempting  the  Tongass  had  been  promulgated  in  an                                                                    
     arbitrary and  capricious manner  and thus  vacated the                                                                    
     exemption  and reinstated  application of  the Roadless                                                                    
     Rule.                                                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
     The Roadless  Rule will adversely impact  potential new                                                                    
     hydro-electric   projects    and   the   infrastructure                                                                    
     required  to  support  these   projects,  and  it  will                                                                    
     adversely  impact  exploration  and  mining  activities                                                                    
     within inventoried Roadless Areas as well.                                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
     It  is   also  important   to  know  that   the  phrase                                                                    
     "inventoried roadless areas"  does not necessarily mean                                                                    
     "Roadless Areas".   Many  of the  "inventoried roadless                                                                    
     areas" have  an extensive  road system  and one  of the                                                                    
     previous speakers stated  that there may be  as many as                                                                    
     4500 miles of logging roads  in the Tongass.  These are                                                                    
     roads that you  can drive on with your car  but many of                                                                    
     these  have   none  the  less  been   included  in  the                                                                    
     "inventoried roadless areas" and  cannot be used by the                                                                    
     public.                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
     The  same thing  has occurred  in the  Chugach National                                                                    
     Forest and one  example is the Palmer  Creek road which                                                                    
     built in  the early 1900s.   This road was  included in                                                                    
     the "inventoried  roadless areas"  but it  was included                                                                    
     and today use  by the public is not allowed  due to the                                                                    
     Roadless Rule.                                                                                                             
                                                                                                                                
MR. BORELL concluded by reiterating the Alaska Miners                                                                           
Association's support for HJR 20.                                                                                               
                                                                                                                                
[HJR 20 was held over.]                                                                                                         

Document Name Date/Time Subjects
Fisheries - Brown.docx HRES 4/6/2011 1:00:00 PM
Fisheries - Jeffrey.doc HRES 4/6/2011 1:00:00 PM
Fisheries - Jensen.doc HRES 4/6/2011 1:00:00 PM
Game - Yurko.docx HRES 4/6/2011 1:00:00 PM
HB 186 Testimony Jack Reakoff.PDF HRES 4/6/2011 1:00:00 PM
HB 186
HB 186 Wood Bison BackUp.pdf HRES 4/6/2011 1:00:00 PM
HB 186
HB-186 - Wood Bison Comment Ltr 4-4-2011074.pdf HRES 4/6/2011 1:00:00 PM
HJR 20 - hearing request RES.pdf HRES 4/6/2011 1:00:00 PM
HJR 20 - CS ENE.pdf HRES 4/6/2011 1:00:00 PM
HJR 20.pdf HRES 4/6/2011 1:00:00 PM
HJR020-1-2-032311-LEG-N.pdf HRES 4/6/2011 1:00:00 PM
HJR 20 - backup map.pdf HRES 4/6/2011 1:00:00 PM
HJR 20 - Support USFS Tongass Energy Projects 2011.pdf HRES 4/6/2011 1:00:00 PM
HJR 20 - Support SE Conf.pdf HRES 4/6/2011 1:00:00 PM
HJR 20 - Support Petersburg.pdf HRES 4/6/2011 1:00:00 PM
HJR 20 - Sponsor Statement.pdf HRES 4/6/2011 1:00:00 PM
HJR 20 - backup JNU Chamber.pdf HRES 4/6/2011 1:00:00 PM
HB 186 HRES 4.6.11 Additional Backup.PDF HRES 4/6/2011 1:00:00 PM
HB 186
HJR 20 HRES 4.6.11 Additional Testimony.PDF HRES 4/6/2011 1:00:00 PM